Development news: Another AAO6 Editor preview

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Re: Development news: Another AAO6 Editor preview 

Message par Unas » Jeu Mars 01, 2012 2:20 pm

Nope. V6 is intended to be perfect, so I won't include an old, counter-intuitive and badly designed feature in it :-P
Not to mention that having two ways of achieving a simple task is usually rather confusing.

The V5 to V6 converter should take care of this properly in most cases - if you notice a trial where it doesn't tick the checkbox when expected, tell me.
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Re: Development news: Another AAO6 Editor preview 

Message par E.D.Revolution » Jeu Mars 01, 2012 5:16 pm

Hmm... Loop start time... How accurate can one expect to be when putting the point which the track needs to loop? 1.0000 second?

I love the improvement for the text box. Now firefox and chrome can't screw with it with the expandable text box shtick. That gets ANNOYING!

So, since the wait timers got multiplied by 10, when transferring from v5 to v6, with custom pauses (ie [#px]) get multiplied by 10?

Adding on to BP's complaint about contradiction, when expanding, why don't you put it all in one line? For example, Statement x:
Presenting [dropdown menu] redirect to [small text entry box not more than 50 pixels wide]. And then put the [add contradiction button] on the next line? That way, it's cleaner.

What happened to the voice in the text box?

Seems to be more stable in Chrome than Firefox. Can't get it to load on 3.16 (my school) or 11B (my laptop).

I know you have yet to put the places tab, but when I load up my trials, some locations from the v5 default are missing, such as co-council.

For CEs, I think the statements should be displayed by default. Meaning, it's empty when I arrive at it. (This is for both loading a trial and blank).

I think you neglected to mention that VARIABLES haven't been fully implemented. I have some variable-heavy trials and I haven't been able to see what variables I have (on frames that have something to do with variables) nor was I able to add them.

For track volume, why not use a slider?

I think you also forgot to mention that you have not added in the "extra pages" for the evidence. You know, when evidence has so much details, it takes pages to show it all?

What do you think for this spacing-saving idea for under the text box? Typing speed [small text entry box less than 50 pixels wide] voice [dropdown]

For automatic timer: Wait for [small text entry box less than 50 pixels wide]ms? Newer member may not remember that the timers are now in milliseconds instead of centiseconds.

I love the character selection preview. Many times, I have sprites that are SO similar, I can't tell which one it is because I can't tell what the face looks like.

Expanding on BP, I can't seem to close the character selection preview box after I have pressed confirm. On Chrome.

CE blocks. I think the tab should be highlighted when I'm on that tab. Strangely, the tab is highlighted in investigation blocks but not CE blocks.
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Re: Development news: Another AAO6 Editor preview 

Message par Unas » Jeu Mars 01, 2012 7:18 pm

Wow, thanks for the extensive feedback ! :pearl:
I'm glad that you like the updates :-)

E.D.Revolution a écrit :Hmm... Loop start time... How accurate can one expect to be when putting the point which the track needs to loop? 1.0000 second?

I'll have to check that with the sound library itself. At the moment, the field is a value in milliseconds, like all other time values in V6.

E.D.Revolution a écrit :So, since the wait timers got multiplied by 10, when transferring from v5 to v6, with custom pauses (ie [#px]) get multiplied by 10?

Yes, I'll add that to the converter.

E.D.Revolution a écrit :Adding on to BP's complaint about contradiction, when expanding, why don't you put it all in one line?

Actually, that's how it was on the first preview, and how it's supposed to be ;-)
The current ugly stuff is a bug that'll be fixed soon.

E.D.Revolution a écrit :What happened to the voice in the text box?

Voice is now a property of the character (see profiles tab).
A frame will use the voice of the talking character.

E.D.Revolution a écrit :Seems to be more stable in Chrome than Firefox. Can't get it to load on 3.16 (my school) or 11B (my laptop).

In Fx3, it's normal : the V6 editor uses some very recent standards that weren't implemented prior to Fx4.
As for Fx11, I haven't tested yet - on Fx 10 it seems to work even though it's slower.

E.D.Revolution a écrit :when I load up my trials, some locations from the v5 default are missing, such as co-council.

I'll have a look. Can you give me a precise reference to the trial so that I have an example ?

E.D.Revolution a écrit :For CEs, I think the statements should be displayed by default. Meaning, it's empty when I arrive at it. (This is for both loading a trial and blank).

Well, the idea is that when all blocks are closed it's easier to get an overview of the case... Technically, having it opened at startup wouldn't be a problem, but I'd like to have other people's opinion before changing it :-)

E.D.Revolution a écrit :I think you neglected to mention that VARIABLES haven't been fully implemented. I have some variable-heavy trials and I haven't been able to see what variables I have (on frames that have something to do with variables) nor was I able to add them.

Actually, that's a bug in the converter when importing variable actions from V5. I'll fix that.

E.D.Revolution a écrit :For track volume, why not use a slider?

I'm planning to - the music tab is just something I put together in a few minutes yesterday xD

E.D.Revolution a écrit :I think you also forgot to mention that you have not added in the "extra pages" for the evidence. You know, when evidence has so much details, it takes pages to show it all?

Yep, Tap mentioned it earlier. Forgot about that indeed !

E.D.Revolution a écrit :For automatic timer: Wait for [small text entry box less than 50 pixels wide]ms? Newer member may not remember that the timers are now in milliseconds instead of centiseconds.

True, I'll have to make it more obvious that the unit is the ms now.

E.D.Revolution a écrit :CE blocks. I think the tab should be highlighted when I'm on that tab. Strangely, the tab is highlighted in investigation blocks but not CE blocks.

Indeed, thanks for pointing it out. I forgot to take care of that in CE blocks :-)

E.D.Revolution a écrit :Expanding on BP, I can't seem to close the character selection preview box after I have pressed confirm. On Chrome.

Okay, this definitely means you've caught a JS bug somewhere. The confirm button is supposed to close the screen editor immediately. If it doesn't, it means the script was interrupted by a failure...
Next time it happens, can you check the Firefox error console (tools -> web developer -> error console) and tell me if you see a Javascript error from AAO ?

Thanks :-)
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Re: Development news: Another AAO6 Editor preview 

Message par Bad Player » Jeu Mars 01, 2012 7:46 pm

Unas a écrit :
E.D.Revolution a écrit :What happened to the voice in the text box?

Voice is now a property of the character (see profiles tab).
A frame will use the voice of the talking character.

What if (for whatever reason) you want to use a different voice for a few frames?

E.D.Revolution a écrit :For track volume, why not use a slider?

I'm planning to - the music tab is just something I put together in a few minutes yesterday xD

Can you have the slider and the number? I like being able to keep things precise xD
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Re: Development news: Another AAO6 Editor preview 

Message par Meph » Jeu Mars 01, 2012 10:00 pm

There's two things I'd like to point out: :)
  • The checkboxes and radio buttons are centred. You need to remove the width and height properties, because each OS sizes them differently.
  • I know I've said this before, but please use the <select> element when you can. The custom select widget is slow and doesn't have all of the optimisations (also, could you give the select widget's dropdown panel a max-height? :) ).

Well, the idea is that when all blocks are closed it's easier to get an overview of the case... Technically, having it opened at startup wouldn't be a problem, but I'd like to have other people's opinion before changing it :-)

I agree with ED. It can give users a useful reference for knowing which part of the trial they're viewing. It provides context. Plus, it's convenient. :)

I'm planning to - the music tab is just something I put together in a few minutes yesterday xD

If you're going to add a slider, make sure it's a HTML5 ranged input. :P

True, I'll have to make it more obvious that the unit is the ms now.

Is it possible to use the ::after pseudo-element in an input box? We could do it using that. ::after { content: " ms"; }

Bad Player a écrit :What if (for whatever reason) you want to use a different voice for a few frames?

Then you'll have to create a new character. This is the consequence of the new system. If we get enough feedback against it, we could always change it. We could let you change the voice when you click on the "manual sync" button.
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Re: Development news: Another AAO6 Editor preview 

Message par ShadowEdgeworth » Jeu Mars 01, 2012 10:36 pm

Wow... I'm most impressed! Must say I'm really looking forward to using this new creation... bringing a bit of AAI into the proceedings. ;D
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Re: Development news: Another AAO6 Editor preview 

Message par Unas » Jeu Mars 01, 2012 11:43 pm

I just pushed a couple of bugfixes after ED's comments :-)

Meph a écrit :
I'm planning to - the music tab is just something I put together in a few minutes yesterday xD

If you're going to add a slider, make sure it's a HTML5 ranged input. :P

Remember that I'm lazy. What else could I do but chose the simplest solution, when it does perfectly what I need ? :-P

Meph a écrit :
Well, the idea is that when all blocks are closed it's easier to get an overview of the case... Technically, having it opened at startup wouldn't be a problem, but I'd like to have other people's opinion before changing it :-)

I agree with ED. It can give users a useful reference for knowing which part of the trial they're viewing. It provides context. Plus, it's convenient. :)

Okay, I see your point. I'll probably do that.

Meph a écrit :The checkboxes and radio buttons are centred. You need to remove the width and height properties, because each OS sizes them differently.

Yes, how browsers place the element inside of its containing box differs (Chrome centers it, Firefox left-aligns it) but I don't really have a problem with it, as long as the size of the containing box is respected.
I might change it by adding an explicit containing box though...

Meph a écrit :I know I've said this before, but please use the <select> element when you can. The custom select widget is slow and doesn't have all of the optimisations (also, could you give the select widget's dropdown panel a max-height? :) ).

Slow ? What are you running it on ? o_o
On my computer, it's instantaneous, like a real select element...
That being said, I'll probably revert all the selects that don't require the preview feature to browser elements, just because they are less prone to bugs than my widget :-P
Also, what's this about max-height ? The positioning and size of the widget is absolute and done manually, not using CSS - and it should always be "optimal" (Best compromise size/readability in my opinion), if my algorithm works properly. If you've got a particular problem with it, I'll need a screenshot ;-)
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Re: Development news: Another AAO6 Editor preview 

Message par Meph » Ven Mars 02, 2012 12:02 am

Unas a écrit :Yes, how browsers place the element inside of its containing box differs (Chrome centers it, Firefox left-aligns it) but I don't really have a problem with it, as long as the size of the containing box is respected. I might change it by adding an explicit containing box though...

I don't know what everyone else thinks, but -- personally -- I don't like the way it looks, like that. It looks messy and confusing. Users are used to having text next to a checkbox, and it's a standard UI design.

Unas a écrit :Slow ? What are you running it on ? o_o
On my computer, it's instantaneous, like a real select element...
That being said, I'll probably revert all the selects that don't require the preview feature to browser elements, just because they are less prone to bugs than my widget :-P
Also, what's this about max-height ? The positioning and size of the widget is absolute and done manually, not using CSS - and it should always be "optimal" (Best compromise size/readability in my opinion), if my algorithm works properly. If you've got a particular problem with it, I'll need a screenshot ;-)

I'm running Firefox 12 on a slow computer. :XD: On my computer, when I click on the select widget, a small square appears, and then it stretches when the select options load.

As for the max-height, I'm suggesting it because I don't think select dropdown boxes need to be as high as the viewport. :)
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Re: Development news: Another AAO6 Editor preview 

Message par Chauer » Ven Mars 02, 2012 1:49 pm

My complaints:
1. You can't put multiple characters on a single witness stand without using a custom place.
2. Long names bug up the buttons over the text input window.
3. No playtesting/saving. I'd be glad to save my trial and test it later when the player is done.
4. I'm a bit not comfortable with the characters adding screen.
5. It is a pain to make one character appear behind the another one.
But whatever you do is fine.
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Re: Development news: Another AAO6 Editor preview 

Message par Meph » Ven Mars 02, 2012 7:03 pm

2. Which text input window do you mean? :)
3. Unas said in the main post that he will add that later.
4. What don't you like about it?
5. That's a good point. There should be better support for layering.

Unas, maybe you should disable the Save and Playtest buttons until you implement those features. :)
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Re: Development news: Another AAO6 Editor preview 

Message par Wolf Speaker » Mer Mars 28, 2012 3:44 am

I don't know much at all about the trial editor, but just wondering...would it be possible to insert animation sequences? Like, for example, during the prologue, having moving, complete images and such?
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Re: Development news: Another AAO6 Editor preview 

Message par Bad Player » Mer Mars 28, 2012 3:59 am

If you do it all in .gifs or something, then it's fine. If it's .avi or a youtube movie or whatever, then... no
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Re: Development news: Another AAO6 Editor preview 

Message par E.D.Revolution » Mer Mars 28, 2012 4:11 am

You'll have to convert any movie to .gif or .apng (though if you make an apng of the same GIF, it's gonna be much bigger without the coloring problems.)
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Re: Development news: Another AAO6 Editor preview 

Message par Unas » Mer Mars 28, 2012 11:48 am

Animations are still only supported as GIFs, yes.
For the moment, AAO6 doesn't support real videos.

Well, technically, the editor supports APNGs like any other image format, but many browsers don't, because APNGs are not really standard. And actually, Chrome doesn't natively support APNG, though there is an extension that more or less emulates it.

Anyway, since AAO6 is aiming at being fully standards-compliant and cross-browser, I'd recommend against using APNGs unless absolutely necessary, so GIF is the way to go. :-)
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