[GK2♫][M][CE] Cascade Theater ●

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Ferdielance
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Re: [M][CE] Cascade Theater ●

Post by Ferdielance »

Spoiler : Spoilers :
DWaM wrote:Well, it's an 'accident' in his eyes. Also, I don't seem to recall any actual mention of a head wound...


I only suggested a head wound because it was the most likely way for Larry to kill Maya accidentally in that situation. But if he murdered her, that's a whole other question.

The way I saw it, considering that "The Dark Age of Law" (dammit, I can't believe I'm actually trying to tie into that) was slowly starting upon them and considering that the loss was far bigger than the gain (since all the trials he was involved in over the past few years would come into question and all the potential criminals released) he did it for the "greater good".
But why use Larry, of all people? The most incompetent man in the world?
Anyway, yeah. This was more of me just putting characters into the darkest scenario possible, something they hadn't really faced before, and exploring how they would react to it (which ended up coming off as OOC, I suppose - but even if not, I guess that the reaction can be considered justified when you put characters you're familiar with and add your own stuff on top of it...)
I'm sympathetic to this, as I ran into the same exact problem in writing AtBaS. Cascade Theater pushes far enough that you could have renamed the characters, removed some background (channeling Mia), and had a mostly unrecognizable case and cast - something I may end up doing with my game.

When your writing reaches that point, why not write an original VN? If you did that, you'd need to greatly flesh out the characters, since you couldn't rely on their canon backgrounds, but that would be an improvement in CT's breathless pacing.

This isn't something I'm suggesting offhandedly - I feel as though I'd be rating this much, much more highly if all the characters had different names and sprites, and were given new backgrounds to justify it. Where do you draw the line between "AU" and "new world?" Likewise, a weakness of Turnabout Tomorrow was the way it jarred awkwardly with AA elements. I can't help but think you should be writing entirely new and original VNs. You have the skill for it, and the AA characters don't mesh at all with your style. It's holding you back from your potential.

Let me be clear: I'm not against fancases in any way! Far from it. But I am against people cramping their own style and making work that doesn't have internal unity and consistency.

(If I ever finish chapter 2 of AtBaS, feel free to copy-paste this critique, do a find/replace on the title, and post it back at me.)
"A slow sort of country!" said the Queen. "Now, here, you see, it takes all the running you can do, to keep in the same place. If you want to get somewhere else, you must run at least twice as fast as that!"
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DWaM
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Re: [M][CE] Cascade Theater ●

Post by DWaM »

Ferdielance wrote:
Spoiler : :
Anyway, yeah. This was more of me just putting characters into the darkest scenario possible, something they hadn't really faced before, and exploring how they would react to it (which ended up coming off as OOC, I suppose - but even if not, I guess that the reaction can be considered justified when you put characters you're familiar with and add your own stuff on top of it...)
I'm sympathetic to this, as I ran into the same exact problem in writing AtBaS. Cascade Theater pushes far enough that you could have renamed the characters, removed some background (channeling Mia), and had a mostly unrecognizable case and cast - something I may end up doing with my game.

When your writing reaches that point, why not write an original VN? If you did that, you'd need to greatly flesh out the characters, since you couldn't rely on their canon backgrounds, but that would be an improvement in CT's breathless pacing.

This isn't something I'm suggesting offhandedly - I feel as though I'd be rating this much, much more highly if all the characters had different names and sprites, and were given new backgrounds to justify it. Where do you draw the line between "AU" and "new world?" Likewise, a weakness of Turnabout Tomorrow was the way it jarred awkwardly with AA elements. I can't help but think you should be writing entirely new and original VNs. You have the skill for it, and the AA characters don't mesh at all with your style. It's holding you back from your potential.

Let me be clear: I'm not against fancases in any way! Far from it. But I am against people cramping their own style and making work that doesn't have internal unity and consistency.

(If I ever finish chapter 2 of AtBaS, feel free to copy-paste this critique, do a find/replace on the title, and post it back at me.)
Spoiler : :
It's not as if I hadn't considered it -- hell, I'm drifting away from AA elements altogether as time goes by, and chances are I'll eventually just drop the entire cast (well, I sort of already have with ADB...) to avoid an issue like this rising again -- but on the subject of making my VN... eh...

It would require a certain commitment, time and other people that I simply don't have at the moment. Now, if you mean in the sense of doing something resembling a VN done in the editor -- that's something I could do, but anything beyond that is kinda... in the grey, for me. Someday, perhaps.
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Re: [GK2♫][M][CE] Cascade Theater ●

Post by Ping' »

Spoiler : :
Well, the "VN in the editor" is essentially what we tried with the despair comp case, and the result was very promising if I may say so.
Reverie
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Re: [GK2♫][M][CE] Cascade Theater ●

Post by Reverie »

Hmm... I'd liked to have not asked this, but could you, in spoiler tags, just put the number of endings there are? I really want to see it all, and a number is all I really need...
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DWaM
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Re: [GK2♫][M][CE] Cascade Theater ●

Post by DWaM »

Spoiler : :
11

That's counting a route which only differentiates on the last scene, but not counting an ending which can be extended depending on some of the optional stuff you could do or the joke endings.
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Blizdi
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Re: [GK2♫][M][CE] Cascade Theater ●

Post by Blizdi »

DWaM wrote:
Spoiler : :
11

That's counting a route which only differentiates on the last scene, but not counting an ending which can be extended depending on some of the optional stuff you could do or the joke endings.

I got the
Spoiler : ending spoiler :
Ascension/redemption ending... is that the good ending?
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DWaM
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Re: [GK2♫][M][CE] Cascade Theater ●

Post by DWaM »

Spoiler : :
There's still one more "true end". A bit counter-intuitive to get, as some would say, but that is the last ending to get.
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Blizdi
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Re: [GK2♫][M][CE] Cascade Theater ●

Post by Blizdi »

DWaM wrote:
Spoiler : :
There's still one more "true end". A bit counter-intuitive to get, as some would say, but that is the last ending to get.
I need a guide for this lol, its very good, but depressing as hell...
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Reverie
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Re: [GK2♫][M][CE] Cascade Theater ●

Post by Reverie »

So far I've gotten...
Spoiler : :
Disallow -> Press All
Disallow -> Press 4th -> Present
Allow -> Present Badge at only statement
and I also ventured a little further into the Allow path, but it looked exactly the same as the disallow...
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Re: [GK2♫][M][CE] Cascade Theater ●

Post by mAc Chaos »

Go back further and take other choices.
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Xaranid
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Re: [GK2♫][M][CE] Cascade Theater ●

Post by Xaranid »

Alright, so far I've seen the:
Spoiler : :
Ascended endings (Drop ticket, both endings from there. The second was the heartwarming, seemingly true ending.)

I've also gotten the:
Secret badge ending
Answer phone -> Allow
and Answer phone -> Disallow

I just tried the don't answer phone -> But I can't... which prompted me for a passcode. Should I know the answer by now, or will it be extremely explicit once I find the right ending? If I have seen it already and just missed it, would you be so kind as to let me know what it is? The "case" is great but each ending takes a while to get through so I'd rather not rewatch one of the longer ones again...
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Re: [GK2♫][M][CE] Cascade Theater ●

Post by DWaM »

Spoiler : :
Well, the drop ticket ending should've been the last one you did (for the sake of everything making sense)...

The passcode is something you should be able to see through one of the paths (one which will unlock once two certain conditions are met - that is, two certain endings are reached).

Also, you know there is an option to go back to your last decision and see other stuff, right? The "Answer Phone" path was a bit irky on that since you had to do the same stuff, but in the "Don't answer" path, things will actually drastically change depending on which choice you make...
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Re: [GK2♫][M][CE] Cascade Theater ●

Post by discipledoctor »

Spoiler : :
Hey there DWaM, first off, great work with this. It's definitely a great example of how the AA universe can be applied to something that's totally different from what the games usually are, and the execution is just great as well. It really does earn that D for Depressing, and not in some overdramatic cheap way, either.

That said, I think I'm struggling a bit trying to find everything. So far I've gotten these endings:

-The one where you take the girl's trial (sorry that I don't recall the name, it's been awhile since I've played but now I'm back to finish it), then it shows throughout the case how Phoenix killed the guy and then goes to the girl in the detention center and basically says that he owns her.

-A similar one to that, but instead Phoenix kills himself at the end.

-The one where you ignore the phone call and Larry comes to talk with Nick. I put the code word as "Redemption" and it gave me a ending that felt kind of cut-off.

-Both the "Ascension" endings where you drop the ticket. Was the whole Ascension thing meant to be the true ending?

-The joke Badge Master ending


That being said, what else do I need to work on? I've read the spoiler posts here and it seems that there's away to carry the trial with the girl on, and I've also read about a "grimdark" Trucy ending? I certainly won't ask for a guide, but what other kinds of things might I need to do in order to achieve these other endings?

Thanks in advance.
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Re: [GK2♫][M][CE] Cascade Theater ●

Post by Blackrune »

discipledoctor wrote:
Spoiler : :
Hey there DWaM, first off, great work with this. It's definitely a great example of how the AA universe can be applied to something that's totally different from what the games usually are, and the execution is just great as well. It really does earn that D for Depressing, and not in some overdramatic cheap way, either.

That said, I think I'm struggling a bit trying to find everything. So far I've gotten these endings:

-The one where you take the girl's trial (sorry that I don't recall the name, it's been awhile since I've played but now I'm back to finish it), then it shows throughout the case how Phoenix killed the guy and then goes to the girl in the detention center and basically says that he owns her.

-A similar one to that, but instead Phoenix kills himself at the end.

-The one where you ignore the phone call and Larry comes to talk with Nick. I put the code word as "Redemption" and it gave me a ending that felt kind of cut-off.

-Both the "Ascension" endings where you drop the ticket. Was the whole Ascension thing meant to be the true ending?

-The joke Badge Master ending


That being said, what else do I need to work on? I've read the spoiler posts here and it seems that there's away to carry the trial with the girl on, and I've also read about a "grimdark" Trucy ending? I certainly won't ask for a guide, but what other kinds of things might I need to do in order to achieve these other endings?

Thanks in advance.
Spoiler : :
...I think you skipped a lot of the game by guessing a password you weren't supposed to guess. Basically, when Phoenix asks Larry to leave, you can actually just leave. There's a lot more to explore on that path.
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Re: [GK2♫][M][CE] Cascade Theater ●

Post by discipledoctor »

Blackrune wrote:
discipledoctor wrote:
Spoiler : :
Hey there DWaM, first off, great work with this. It's definitely a great example of how the AA universe can be applied to something that's totally different from what the games usually are, and the execution is just great as well. It really does earn that D for Depressing, and not in some overdramatic cheap way, either.

That said, I think I'm struggling a bit trying to find everything. So far I've gotten these endings:

-The one where you take the girl's trial (sorry that I don't recall the name, it's been awhile since I've played but now I'm back to finish it), then it shows throughout the case how Phoenix killed the guy and then goes to the girl in the detention center and basically says that he owns her.

-A similar one to that, but instead Phoenix kills himself at the end.

-The one where you ignore the phone call and Larry comes to talk with Nick. I put the code word as "Redemption" and it gave me a ending that felt kind of cut-off.

-Both the "Ascension" endings where you drop the ticket. Was the whole Ascension thing meant to be the true ending?

-The joke Badge Master ending


That being said, what else do I need to work on? I've read the spoiler posts here and it seems that there's away to carry the trial with the girl on, and I've also read about a "grimdark" Trucy ending? I certainly won't ask for a guide, but what other kinds of things might I need to do in order to achieve these other endings?

Thanks in advance.
Spoiler : :
...I think you skipped a lot of the game by guessing a password you weren't supposed to guess. Basically, when Phoenix asks Larry to leave, you can actually just leave. There's a lot more to explore on that path.
Spoiler : :
Wait, really? I had gotten that password, I believe, from the Ascension endings. But I must have gone through that Larry path five times and never noticed any option other than getting the password right, or getting it wrong. Crap, thanks for the tip! I'm gonna have to check this out.
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