A New Kind of Turnabout

Join in with competitions to make the best trials... with a twist!

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OrderOfTheNick
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A New Kind of Turnabout

Post by OrderOfTheNick »

A New Kind of Turnabout

Don't have the structure dictate the story, have the story dictate the structure.


ImageImage
We all know how an Ace Attorney case goes: First, a murder happens, someone is arrested and you take their case. Then you investigate - examine places and talk to people. And finally, you go to the trial and use what you've learned to try to prove your client innocent. Repeat the last two a maximum of two times until the killer is found. All the cases take at most three days, they all happen only after one day of investigation(or without an investigation) and there's only a single afternoon to investigate between trial days.

Task

Your task is: Make a story with a structure different from Ace Attorney cases.

You need to forget this formula that we'd grown accustomed to. While it's perfectly fine for Ace Attorney, it limits the kinds of stories you can tell. There's so many interesting situations you can put characters through if you're not limited by having to get them to the trial the next day, and it allows for more interesting events!
You no longer have to save all the big revelations for the trial. You can have the main character stay unconscious for a day, or gets taken hostage. You can make them something other than a defense attorney or prosecutor. You can have a case where you only investigate.
There's an endless number of possibilities if you let your imagination dictate the flow of the story instead of the AA formula!

Of course, this doesn't mean you can't have trials or investigations - or their mechanics -, but they can't follow each other as strictly as they do in Ace Attorney.

To make it perfectly clear, I'm looking for cases that refrain from only using the traditional AA investigations and trials, and either use their mechanics differently to tell a story, or don't use their mechanics at all.
(It's fine if there are investigation and/or trial segments in the case, as long as a major part of the case isn't strictly an investigation or trial. The one thing to keep in mind is: Don't fall into a formula, don't have this be "just another case".)
Don't have the structure dictate the story, have the story dictate the structure.

Judging
All entries will be judged in four categories:
Story - A good story needs to be interesting and engaging, with characters who act and interact in entertaining and/or exciting ways.If there is a mystery, it should be intriguing and -if the case is finished - it should have a logical solution.
Presentation - How well the graphics and music fit the story, and how well the case is put together inside the editor.
Gameplay - How fair and fun the game and its puzzles are. Also, how smoothly the game mechanics fit into the story.
Theme Relevance - How much you break the Ace Attorney formula. The less you rely on the AA games for the structure of your story, the better.

Rules
  • The entry must have been created between August 17, 2017 and November 17, 2017.
  • The entry must not be showcased until after the winner has been announced.
  • The entry may be any type, as long as it follows the other rules.
  • The entry must not consist of only alternating (AA-style) investigations and trials, or only a single trial.
  • The entry must (at least partly) consist of sections that aren't AA-style investigations or trials.
  • The entry must not contain any spoilers for Dai Gyakuten Saiban or Dai Gyakuten Saiban 2. It may spoil any other AA game. If it contains spoilers for other (non-AA) games, this must be made clear when submitted.
  • The entry must be submitted to OrderOfTheNick by the deadline, along with a walkthrough(if the game offers any choices, and/or has gameplay).
  • The entry may be incomplete.
Deadline
Entries must be submitted to OrderOfTheNick via PM before November 17, 2017 23:59 UTC +1
(Or before I wake up the next day. Being a few hours late doesn't immediately disqualify an entry.)

Entrants
(Gumpei and Holhol)
Ann-nna - The Missing Turnabout
Declaro
(.Saboteur)
DWard14
(RedeyesofDN)
clcman and Mr. Insane - The BASEic Turnabout
Last edited by OrderOfTheNick on Mon Nov 20, 2017 7:53 pm, edited 9 times in total.
I made Turnabout in the Two Towers, the winner of the Method in the Madness case competition.
Gumpei
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Re: A New Kind of Turnabout

Post by Gumpei »

Oh h*ck yeah this rules. Count me in.
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Ann-nna
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Re: A New Kind of Turnabout

Post by Ann-nna »

Oh my, oh my, for once I have just the scenario, but I want to use my own characters whom I've yet to sprite. DX Don't want to promise anything, but I'll try to enter.
Declaro
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Re: A New Kind of Turnabout

Post by Declaro »

I also have an idea, and it should be something I can work on in my free time, so count me in, I guess.
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OrderOfTheNick
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Re: A New Kind of Turnabout

Post by OrderOfTheNick »

Alright, added everyone to the list.
I made Turnabout in the Two Towers, the winner of the Method in the Madness case competition.
DWard14
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Re: A New Kind of Turnabout

Post by DWard14 »

I've got a question. In the post you say you can have a case where you only investigate, yet in the rules you say the case must partly consist of something other than AA style investigations or trials.

So would an investigation only trial be permitted?
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.Saboteur
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Re: A New Kind of Turnabout

Post by .Saboteur »

I'll sign up. Hopefully I won't be too strapped for time with school but I've got an idea I'd like to try and make for this.
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OrderOfTheNick
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Re: A New Kind of Turnabout

Post by OrderOfTheNick »

DWard14 wrote:I've got a question. In the post you say you can have a case where you only investigate, yet in the rules you say the case must partly consist of something other than AA style investigations or trials.

So would an investigation only trial be permitted?
It is allowed, but it can't be just a typical AA investigation. It would need to have elements that AA investigations don't have.(So it can't just be full of investigation blocks and dialogue. It needs to have other gameplay elements. In an AA investigation, you almost never do anything but use the Move, Examine, Talk and Present buttons.)
.Saboteur wrote:I'll sign up. Hopefully I won't be too strapped for time with school but I've got an idea I'd like to try and make for this.
Adding you to the list.
I made Turnabout in the Two Towers, the winner of the Method in the Madness case competition.
DWard14
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Re: A New Kind of Turnabout

Post by DWard14 »

I'll sign up then. No promises though.
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OrderOfTheNick
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Re: A New Kind of Turnabout

Post by OrderOfTheNick »

Okay, adding you.
I made Turnabout in the Two Towers, the winner of the Method in the Madness case competition.
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lazyplague
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Re: A New Kind of Turnabout

Post by lazyplague »

Hey me and Spyromed were discussing this, and it seems like something's a TAD confusing about your theme. While you emphasize changing structure, a lot of your posts imply that gameplay mechanics NEED to have something completely different no matter what. This confuses me because it seems a bit short-sighted, as narrative structure in AA could be bent a significant amount without needing to change gameplay much, if at all.

To be clearer, the competition is based around "story," but you're pushing a heavy "Gameplay mechanics need to be messed with, or just not have these same mechanics at all," message. While mechanics and structure intertwine, a competent case-maker could see the already existing mechanics, and change how they are used in the context of the story.

tl;dr - I'd really like some clarity on what specifically you're looking for in an entry, and why you chose to focus it the way you have.
Declaro
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Re: A New Kind of Turnabout

Post by Declaro »

So is an AAI-style case okay?
DWard14
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Re: A New Kind of Turnabout

Post by DWard14 »

Declaro wrote:So is an AAI-style case okay?
As long as it isn't just investigating and cross-examinations it should be fine. As long as you add Logic Chess or even just logic I don't see why not.
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OrderOfTheNick
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Re: A New Kind of Turnabout

Post by OrderOfTheNick »

Dave wrote:While mechanics and structure intertwine, a competent case-maker could see the already existing mechanics, and change how they are used in the context of the story.
Actually, that is the kind of case I'm looking for. I'm sorry if the post came out confusing, it's a mess. The story is the most important. While I do mention omitting/adding mechanics, that isn't the main focus. Instead, the structure needs to be different for the trial to qualify. The same mechanics can be used, just not in the same way AA uses them. By which I mean the trial can't have the same structure with the investigations and trials following each other.
OrderOfTheNick wrote: [*]The entry must not consist of only alternating (AA-style) investigations and trials, or only a single trial.
[*]The entry must (at least partly) consist of sections that aren't AA-style investigations or trials.
The reason these two rules exist is to make sure trials have to change the structure. The gameplay/game flow will change, but the mechanics don't have to. Using the default mechanics is fine, but the structure of the case must be different.
I also made it possible to create a case that DOES have an investigation and a trial, but since the competition is about changing the structure, they can't be "AA-style" investigations/trials - which just means that somehow, they have to be distinctly different from the ones in the games. How the investigations/trials differ isn't specified in the rules, because the structure of a potential investigation or a trial should be determined by the story, and not by me.
(Of course, a great story can be made only using the AA structure as well, the theme isn't about making the most out of the preexisting structure, but creating a new structure.
Declaro wrote:So is an AAI-style case okay?
An AAI-style case(where the cross-examinations aren't in court, but during the investigations) is fine, as long as it doesn't have an Investigation-Rebuttals-Investigation-Rebuttals-etc. structure all the way through. Meaning that as long as something breaks up the investigations and rebuttals, it should be fine.
I made Turnabout in the Two Towers, the winner of the Method in the Madness case competition.
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RedeyesofDN
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Re: A New Kind of Turnabout

Post by RedeyesofDN »

So to make a further point, the type of structure your looking to avoid is, with regard to AA is [Day1: Trial (Verdict - END] or [Invest - Day1: Trial - Invest Day2: ...] and so on and so forth the models used commonly in the franchise. With variation should be coupled with a story that makes that variation make sense - with the story being graded more heavily then the variation itself? Would that be a proper understanding?
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